Wall of Mouths

Well, however you work out your best of, whatever your opinions are, I suspect that the band might want to listen.

Yeah, sure, I have the utmost respect for them.

Yeah, sure, they have been in the industry 13+ years, and I haven’t.

But it’s been a long running conversation regarding their live set.

This current tour, obviously lots of High Anxiety tracks, no issues there.

Last tour, lots of Shameless tracks.

The tour before that, well, a general mix plus Fat Camp and Bad Karma…, as you’d expect.

But as much as I feel that a band that has been around for 13+ years can do WTF it wants, (of course!), I feel there should be some surprises.

Given the demographic of their live audience (and this is my best guest), OK, there are going to be some songs they HAVE to play .. but moving on many albums since Troublegum, I feel a lot of “those people” have gone by the by, and maybe less emphasis is needed there.

The current feeling seems to be “the current album plus four or five Troublegum plus whatever else we might fit in that we like”. Fair enough. They are your instruments and you do what you will with them.

But given the.. well, cult following this band seems to have, and acknowledging that many people see the band more than just the once on each tour, perhaps some variety is needed.

Now, we are aware that the band will do a more Megadeth-style “vote for a live track” (if anyone ever visited that web site) next time, come Sep/Oct… but surely something a bit more exciting would be of order? Imagine if you were a fan since 1991 and you had seen the band once per year — how many surprises? Well, apart from an opening of Evil Elvis, I’m suspecting very few indeed.

So, how about this — if a set consisted of 5-6 songs from the current album, 3 songs from Troublegum (which we can pay homage to as the album that made them) but from a selection of, say, 8 — so it’s always mixed up (you might hear one of Screamager, Die Laughing and Nowhere, one of Knives, Trigger Inside and Isolation, and one of Lunacy Booth, Turn and Femtex), a couple of songs from the rest of the albums (Shameless neglected HOW MUCH on this last tour!) and then have three spots throughout the set list that are just left there for “surprises”… And each single night, they are completely different. And I’m talking about things like a selection of three from (and due respect to the band, I know rehearsal time can be at a premium) Jude The Obscene, C C Rider, Little Tongues First, Accelerator, Loose, Dancin’ With Manson, Opal Mantra, Misery, Fat Camp, A Moment Of Clarity, Our Love Must Die, Jam Jar Jail, Animal Bones, Stalk & Slash, Bad Karma…, Black Eye, Purple Sky, Punishment Kiss, Skyward, Wall Of Mouths, Straight Life (goddamit!), This One’s For You, flipping heck, even a one-off of Mama You Can Call The Ambulance Now… there’s a good list of (let me count…) some 22 songs there… take a random three from that list and play at each gig… it will add some extra spice and excitment.

Of course, T? are phenomenal live, and I still enjoy going to see them whatever the set list (even if it is 3 or 4 times each tour), but I can’t help feeling (not trying to do a grandmother and eggs thing here) that there needs to be something new. And I believe that a “random-three-song-injection” would bolster attendances and create a bit of a buzz.

Now maybe this is the wrong thread, and maybe I’ve said this in the wrong way, but it’s something I feel very strongly about. But I also know that people in a band have their own agendas, as do management, and no matter how much fans complain (or constructively comment!) it doesn’t change things. Well, maybe this will. I don’t hold out much hope, but given the comments I have read from other people (despite personal preferences for the songs themselves) I do believe that, as a whole, people here want some sort of live variety.

That is all.

I shall get my coat…

Some sort of ‘Gemil Of Fortune’? That would be cool :D

Totally agree with you guys.

i think they could have rehearsed some new songs during the sound check … think they did that with teethgrinder.

i don´t get it why the set list never changed in this tour.
and some dates, they played bad mother, on some they didn´t.

T? told us, that they are very suprised by our voting results. Okay okay some people voted for screamger, nowhere … and stuff they probably will be playing … no matter what … these people didn´t get it what the vote was all about.
but apart from that … a song like “evil elvis” was there high up in the results. i don´t get it why all the votes were suprising for them? they should have cut out things like screamager and stuff and they would had a good result.
Perhaps its really not T? themselves who decides the set list?

But all my hopes are for the next tour. they said, that they wanted to have an new vote, in which they pick the songs … i think it would be a better idea to just say which songs cannot be voted for … let the fans decide everything else …

neil is new … i know … everyone says, he does a great job … but i think a real therapy? drummer is able to know more than 20 songs … perhaps he can, we don`t know … perhaps it is really a reason that T? themselves do not decide …

mooneycult wrote:

back on the topic…

doesn’t a therapy? greatest hits album require all those songs to have been released as singles, and presumably to have made it reasonably high into the charts?

Then make it a “Best Of”

Hmmm, quite an interesting thread. I started reading it thinking that I have read this type of thread many times, what is your best of… but it quickly went of at a different tangent, which was quite interesting. I have seen T? plenty of times, and there are loads of songs that I would love to see them play, like Jam Jar Jail, Evil Elvis. Why not send your comments to the bands email address, and see what they have to say?

i think the discusion about the same live songs comes around every new tour. i also think that they could really add some spice to the setlist, for example not always start with the first song of the new album. why not start with a b-side for example and then kick out something well known as 2nd song, that would be a perfect start. when they threw in straight live in cologne i was more then happy because i never heard it live before. it really would be great to have that feeling a few ties more often on t? gigs and not always have half of the time spend on troublegum tracks, i think 3 per concert would do. no one would complain if they would just play, let’s say nowhere, screamager and die laughing.
come on guys, just 2 or 3 unexpected songs or classics you don’t play usually, that’s not to much, right?

I agree. Only 1 song from Shameless (I Am The Money) and even that isn’t played every night. And only 1 song from Suicide Pact. That’s hardly enough newer material.

It just gives ammunition to people I know who say T? are living off the memory of Troublegum, like it’s their only album.

A brilliant “current” set would be:
6 or 7 from High Anxiety
3 or 4 from Shameless
2 or 3 from Suicide Pact
1 or 2 each from each album before that.

This would give around 20 songs, and a lot of surprises. Sure would send me home happy, plus probably most other real fans…

Still, can’t see it happening. :(

mooneycult wrote:

yeah, thats the kinda setlist i’m talking about. thinking about it we could end up with joey, gimme back my brain, little tongues first, wall of mouths (insert sorely missed post troublegum track here!).

Jam Jar Jail, mo’ fo’!!!!!

Alex wrote:

On an aside, when T? did their Virgin in-store, I was chatting to Michael, and I tried to convince him that T? should do Rehab (the Manchild/Andy collaboration) on stage. He looked at me like I was insane.

Perceptive chap…

Great, it seems I’m not the only one… I always have that feeling too when I’m talking to him…

Or maybe I’m just talking too much bullshit :D

try to think of a T? gig without nowhere or die?

wouldn´t be most of the people pissed off then?

On those points, well, T? made great stock during their So Much For The Ten Year Plan promotional tour that it was about all the fans who had _stuck with them_ over 13 years. Yes, sure, T.G. made them big, but the vast majority of people who listened to that album, bought it, and maybe bought I.L. and then gave up on T?, well, they aren’t at the gigs now.

What if you are a “new fan”… Yeah, you might have bought the back catalogue, but maybe Shameless was your first album, and then you got High Anxiety — and where were Shameless tracks on this tour? Nowhere, no pun intended.

And in that situation, _I_ would be disappointed. Sure, for my own personal reasons, I love to hear Die Laughing every time I see T?. Would I be _GUTTED_ if I saw them play and they didn’t play it? Of course not. That would be more than outweighed because that slot would (hopefully) be taken up by what we are coming to refer to as “a surprise”.

Then there’s the argument that what about the fans who are new, bought the back catalogue and want to hear some older stuff. Maybe that’s why there’s such a T.G. emphasis. But hey, if those fans weren’t around during the marketing of Troublegum, the “importance” within the back catalogue of Nowhere compared to, say, Accelerator, really pales into insignificance. Don’t you agree?

And not being in a performing band myself, I can’t answer this — and specifically in this argument, only T? can answer it… but the thrill of a new album surely is going out there any playing it live — it’s something new… Hence 7 tracks from H.A. this tour. So, surely, playing Nowhere for the 100th time this calendar year — well, where’s the fun? Personally (and I know this is just personally) I would love the challenge and the originality, the fun and the (what I am guessing would be) spectacular crowd response from playing something unexpected.

As for the “fan only gig” mentioned above — I have mentioned on several occasions before my love for the concept that Smashing Pumpkins went through — they opened for themselves. That set was older/rarer stuff, and acoustic/reworked stuff. How does this work? The die hard fans get there early and get a double dose, and come away with a bigger smile. The “normal” fans, well, a lot of them miss the support bands anyway, so nothing is changed for them.

OK, the band would have to work twice as hard. Maybe they would be adversed to such a long set (or two). If it was down to beer or money I’m sure everyone would chip in a couple of extra quid to see a two set headline gig.

Failing that, a one (or, say, one per continent) “hard core fan gig” where it is advertised that the band will not play any songs that are “usual set list entries” may not go amiss.

I dunno. I am putting a lot of energy into this (and hope I am coming across fairly coherently) but it’s quite probably all for nothing.

Given that the problems surrounding Neil regarding lack of time have already been mentioned, maybe we really should be having this discussion after the tour later on in the year?

Your points are coming across Alex and I am agreeing with a lot of what you’re saying, but let’s give them a bit of time and see what happens later on in the year. One of my friends is a mate of Neil’s ( used to play bass with him in Cable ), and he says that he’s shit hot at picking stuff up after a couple of listens. With a bit more time maybe we can expect a more diverse set list!

On another note, we were given the chance to vote for the stuff we wanted to hear and as has already been stated, alot of people missed the point of what the vote was about, so if the hardcore fans are voting for the obvious stuff then we can’t really expect the guys to be able to pre guess which set list they should play at which venue I suppose!

This thread has gone right off the topic it was initially posted about! Maybe we should all come up with our ultimate set lists and compare notes!

Superunknown..stay away from that poll function!

Where do you work?

I’m sure you’ve told me, and I’m sure I’ve forgotten.

As for the poll, regardless of the outcome, the point was, the top three songs were not added to each set list!

And if Neil can learn 20 songs in a couple of months for a tour, then surely learning another 5 in the break before the two Irish gigs would not be that hard? {blah, blah, I know there’s logistics and rehearsal time and blah blah. I thin kI’ll leave this topic now :)

Good for you, and I don’t want one. Not until you upgrade your store front security systems anyhow. :-p

:-)